The Relationships Thread

[Slev]

Aren't these guys just the fucking worst? Self-proclaimed "nice guys" are, 99% of the time, anything but.

These guys funamentally missunderstand human interaction. I've seen it theorised that this (and other "flaws" in a significant portion of moden males) is due to a social shift in which men are less socialised by older, more mature men, compared to the past. They end up with a twisted impression of masculinity that they then ape to their own detriment.

Interestingly, what they THINK they are doing would be helpful in getting together with women.

[VizardAmata]

Was absently reading this thread while drinking my post-lunch coffee, and had to comment on this:

He feels I owe him because he's "a nice guy".

Aren't these guys just the fucking worst? Self-proclaimed "nice guys" are, 99% of the time, anything but. They treat sex and relationships like transactions; put in enough deposits of "niceness" (usually involving shallow crap like buying drinks and saying your hair looks nice), and they'll get paid out in pussy. And when it doesn't work , and that's usually the case, it's because women are all shallow whores who just want to use guys for money, and not because he's being, you know, a fucking disgusting creep. It's borderline sociopathic, and sadly disturbingly prevalent - in fact, it's one of the bedrocks of the entire MRA movement. I'm really sorry that your sister had to endure his unsolicited boner rubbing and that he's got his eyes set on you too. I had an experience with a similar type when I was younger and it still makes me shudder to think about it.

I always just fall back to this with these "but I'm a nice guy" types.

[onona]

Oh don't even get me started on friendzoning. The entire concept is predicated on entitlement.

[fluffymoo]

Thanks guys, I really appreciate the replies and words of wisdom <3

[kanet666]

Was absently reading this thread while drinking my post-lunch coffee, and had to comment on this:

He feels I owe him because he's "a nice guy".

Aren't these guys just the fucking worst? Self-proclaimed "nice guys" are, 99% of the time, anything but. They treat sex and relationships like transactions; put in enough deposits of "niceness" (usually involving shallow crap like buying drinks and saying your hair looks nice), and they'll get paid out in pussy. And when it doesn't work , and that's usually the case, it's because women are all shallow whores who just want to use guys for money, and not because he's being, you know, a fucking disgusting creep. It's borderline sociopathic, and sadly disturbingly prevalent - in fact, it's one of the bedrocks of the entire MRA movement. I'm really sorry that your sister had to endure his unsolicited boner rubbing and that he's got his eyes set on you too. I had an experience with a similar type when I was younger and it still makes me shudder to think about it.

I agree with all of what you say and then you go and throw that shite in there. Completely unnecessary and not actually intertwined with being an MRA at all. Some men from ALL groups do it. Feminist men, Egalitarian men, MRA men. Some women do it, although that is far less common. It's just the way some people think, be that biological, societal, or a bit of both.

[onona]

You're actually denying that a significant aspect of the rampant misogyny in the PUA movement revolves around sexual entitlement, a transactional attitude towards sex, and resentment of women who don't succumb to being "bought" with "kindness"? Okay.

Not even going to get into an argument over this, because it's not worth it.

[edit] Oops, I just realised that I wrote MRA earlier, when what I actually meant was PUA.

[Jim]

I had to Google MRA and PUA. I thought they were diseases or some shit...

[Gandalf the Red]

Snap!

Some shit is about right.

[onona]

I had to Google MRA and PUA. I thought they were diseases or some shit...

The whole PUA thing is 100% shitty and horrid, and the MRA movement, whilst having a handful of legitimate gripes (child custody bias, circumcision, compulsory military service) is sadly also infested with sexism and misogyny to a considerable degree.

Personally I fucking despise the whole "battle of the sexes". I sit next to a young guy at work who loves to go on about the "differences" between the way men and women supposedly think and process information, and it's endlessly tiresome. I sometimes just look at him when he's droning on about it, and think about throwing him out the window.

[NeglectedField]

Guess I need to get this off my chest, probably leave myself open to attack somehow but whatever.

So on Saturday after a heavy day of drinking we end up at our favourite club night and our mate's colleague (whom I've met before) turns up and from hazy recollection, after finding ourselves tongue wrestling I end up back at hers, as you do.

The intimacy and affection in the morning was just so lovely, it's bowled me over. I'd forgotten how intoxicating it is. Been in a haze all week, can't concentrate, very different mood and sense of enjoyment/creativity. Sunday hangover was brutal so that may have played a part as well.

She's smart, not sure about overlap of interests aside from general intellectual curiosity. Also the big thing is she's like, 35-40, pushing that maybe? Great body for her age though. Then I saw her in the kitchen light and her age showed a bit more, and I was thinking hmm, I dunno. I know that's mean.

Not sure whether to pursue it any further than our polite short text exchange on Monday. I need to figure out what I want. Even just closure or something.

[kanet666]

[edit] Oops, I just realised that I wrote MRA earlier, when what I actually meant was PUA.

Ah, see THAT we can agree on. The PUA scene is an abomination, but by no means the same as the MRA.

[Warlock]

Guess I need to get this off my chest, probably leave myself open to attack somehow but whatever.

So on Saturday after a heavy day of drinking we end up at our favourite club night and our mate's colleague (whom I've met before) turns up and from hazy recollection, after finding ourselves tongue wrestling I end up back at hers, as you do.

The intimacy and affection in the morning was just so lovely, it's bowled me over. I'd forgotten how intoxicating it is. Been in a haze all week, can't concentrate, very different mood and sense of enjoyment/creativity. Sunday hangover was brutal so that may have played a part as well.

She's smart, not sure about overlap of interests aside from general intellectual curiosity. Also the big thing is she's like, 35-40, pushing that maybe? Great body for her age though. Then I saw her in the kitchen light and her age showed a bit more, and I was thinking hmm, I dunno. I know that's mean.

Not sure whether to pursue it any further than our polite short text exchange on Monday. I need to figure out what I want. Even just closure or something.

There doesn't seem any reason for people to attack you here, it happens to everyone, you shared intimacy and affection and that's great, doesn't mean you have to pursue it further, just enjoy it and try not to think about it too much maybe, but I know what you mean I always think to much, had a date recently and it went well but I'm just not sure I'm that into her, but maybe I'm just being too fussy!

[Warlock]

Anyone who cares that much about how you dress is not worth your time, anyway. I personally don't give a fuck how someone chooses to dress, no matter their choice of music.

What matters is that you have a connection/stuff in common/can actually hold a decent conversation. While it's cool to have a preference for long hair (I do myself), I personally would not give the time of day to someone who put that above a decent personality.

TLDR: The only time you should make a major change in yourself is for YOUR happiness.

Yeah I totally agree with you, and of course those things are more important! Maybe I've just had some bad luck coming across very shallow people! In my experience alot of alt girls seem to only go for the stereotypical look.
And thanks for that! But again I'm not suggesting I'm gonna change, just frustrates me because I consider myself alternative or metal or whatever and feel like I'm overlooked because I don't feel the need to show it all the time

Oh I completely understand your frustrations! As someone who is very much a tomboy, I don't get even looked at most of the time. But it's how I'm comfortable, so whatever. Someone worthwhile will actually not care about that, anyway.

As I said, if you want to change for YOU, then go for it. I've just seen what happens when people change into some kind of "mould" for someone/people. I tried it myself for years, to be "normal" (whatever the fuck that is) and it just didn't work.

Ah you see tom boyish girls don't put me off, I find I can have alot more in common with them! Aw I'm sure you get loads if looks! I agree it's good to do whats comfortable
Yeah thanks, sometimes I think I'll wear some spiky wristbands or something but It's not really that much of a change, but I'm not gonna completely change, I've never really tried to be something I'm not. Yeah those people who do that are irritating. I'm basically a alt/metal guy I just don't always dress that way so people don't think of me in that way

[onona]

[edit] Oops, I just realised that I wrote MRA earlier, when what I actually meant was PUA.

Ah, see THAT we can agree on. The PUA scene is an abomination, but by no means the same as the MRA.

Yeah it was one of those weird brainfart moments where I was thinking one thing but for whatever reason said (or in this case, typed) another.

[onona]

Yeah thanks, sometimes I think I'll wear some spiky wristbands or something but It's not really that much of a change, but I'm not gonna completely change, I've never really tried to be something I'm not. Yeah those people who do that are irritating. I'm basically a alt/metal guy I just don't always dress that way so people don't think of me in that way

Funnily enough, I'm the other way around. I look really rock and roll/punkish/metal because I have a sort of mohawk, I'm heavily tattooed, I wear mostly black, ripped jeans, etc. And yet I listen to very little metal and am far more likely to be listening to 80s pop or 70s rock. I also tend to go for men who don't look rock or metal at all - in fact, I quite specifically go for men who are not rock and roll types, especially as I prefer older men (I'm 36 and I tend to go for men 10-20 years older) and I find rock/metal guys in that age group are often a bit, errr, stuck in a state of arrested development (with exceptions, of course). I'm far more interested in men who are intelligent and funny than men who are into any specific kind of music.