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Re: Motorsport Enthusiasts Corner
Posted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 9:57 am
by kanet666
I hate the team orders. It turns the race into a procession. One of the reasons I love MotoGP, each rider goes for it and teammates can have race-long battles with one another.
Re: Motorsport Enthusiasts Corner
Posted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 10:33 am
by Jim
Looks like this will be another shit F1 season if it's gonna be dominated by crap like so-called 'team orders'.
Re: Motorsport Enthusiasts Corner
Posted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 10:38 am
by Andy Hall
siliconfury wrote:Looks like this will be another shit F1 season if it's gonna be dominated by crap like so-called 'team orders'.
I don't know the racing yesterday was good, Kimi had a great battle yesterday, and listening to the radio makes it very interesting, I can't say the last 2 seasons have been shit, and let's be honest there has never been a season without team orders
Re: Motorsport Enthusiasts Corner
Posted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 10:48 am
by Jim
Indeed, but when a season is dominated by team orders, it takes focus away from good racing. Let's face it - Vettel v Webber yesterday was exciting shit. Risky, yes, but motor racing is risky. The whole team orders palaver overshadowed it.
Re: Motorsport Enthusiasts Corner
Posted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 10:50 am
by Andy Hall
Problem was Webber had turned his engine down and wasn't expecting to be racing, and Vettel was as close as he was because of that, Webber wasn't pushing
Exciting or not, it was always 1 sided as 1 guy had his whole engine available
Re: Motorsport Enthusiasts Corner
Posted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 11:54 pm
by Danroush
Tet wrote:I hated it. Neither Hamilton or Brawn have any integrity. And the less said about Vettel the better.
I don't like Hamilton but I'm confused as to what he did wrong in that race? He even admitted Nico was going faster and could've overtaken him in the post race interview
In terms of Vettel, whilst I agree that he shouldn't have done that in the situation, I strongly think race 2 is far too early for team orders to be involved.
Andy Hall wrote:Problem was Webber had turned his engine down and wasn't expecting to be racing
You got a source on that?
Re: Motorsport Enthusiasts Corner
Posted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 11:59 pm
by kanet666
Danroush wrote:Andy Hall wrote:Problem was Webber had turned his engine down and wasn't expecting to be racing
You got a source on that?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/21916317BBC Sport wrote:Webber said: "After the last stop the team told me the race was over and we turned the engines down and go to the end. The team made their decision. Seb made his own decision and he will have protection as usual."
Re: Motorsport Enthusiasts Corner
Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 12:05 am
by Danroush
kanet666 wrote:Danroush wrote:Andy Hall wrote:Problem was Webber had turned his engine down and wasn't expecting to be racing
You got a source on that?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/21916317BBC Sport wrote:Webber said: "After the last stop the team told me the race was over and we turned the engines down and go to the end. The team made their decision. Seb made his own decision and he will have protection as usual."
Implies both were on the same engine setting?
Re: Motorsport Enthusiasts Corner
Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 12:07 am
by kanet666
You really think that Vettel listened to that given that he didn't listen to the other order?
Re: Motorsport Enthusiasts Corner
Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 12:09 am
by Danroush
kanet666 wrote:You really think that Vettel listened to that given that he didn't listen to the other order?
Direct quote from Horner "They were both on the same engine modes, I'm pretty sure on that but I'll give it a check"
They were on different tyres and strategy which accounts for a difference in speed, along with Seb
probably due to determination and IMO better talent
Re: Motorsport Enthusiasts Corner
Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 1:56 am
by Andy Hall
Absolute twaddle, 1 guy did as he was told the other said fuck this i'm winning at any cost and ignored what he was told simple as that, Webber wasn't pushing, and when he found out Seb wanted him to go faster, he was 1/2 a second quicker a lap than him, the only reason why they were that close was because Webber was at a lower power, I thoroughly believe Vettel wouldn't have been in that position otherwise, Mark Webber was quicker than him throughout this race
and the term WE inplies me and my team, each driver has different mechanics on each car
Re: Motorsport Enthusiasts Corner
Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 2:22 am
by Danroush
Andy Hall wrote:Absolute twaddle, 1 guy did as he was told the other said fuck this i'm winning at any cost and ignored what he was told simple as that, Webber wasn't pushing, and when he found out Seb wanted him to go faster, he was 1/2 a second quicker a lap than him, the only reason why they were that close was because Webber was at a lower power, I thoroughly believe Vettel wouldn't have been in that position otherwise, Mark Webber was quicker than him throughout this race
and the term WE inplies me and my team, each driver has different mechanics on each car
They were on different strategies so of course they'd be at different speeds at different parts of the race, Vettel was leading fairly well until he made the mistake of pitting early (so your claim of Webber being faster all race is out of the window there), and in the context given it strongly implies both drivers did, and even if not I refer you to the direct quote from Horner in my post above
Seems like you like Webber a lot and are getting emotionally biased on the matter
Re: Motorsport Enthusiasts Corner
Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 11:01 am
by Andy Hall
No i watched 3 hours of after race analysis and came to the same conclusion as millions around the world, Vettell is a fucking cheat
And i'm not a Red Bull fan, i'm a McClaren fan, I couldn't care less about either driver, every news paper and tv channel was showing the same interviews from both drivers, and team principles, hell even the Red Bull team boss said the drivers were ordered to maintain station and that was live on Sky Sports just before the drivers were on the podium
Sounds to me like you have a thing for Sebastian Vettell more than anything, as even when evidence from multiple people on here are given to you, you ignore it, reminds me a little of myself on here over the years
Re: Motorsport Enthusiasts Corner
Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 11:27 am
by Tet
Danroush wrote:I don't like Hamilton but I'm confused as to what he did wrong in that race? He even admitted Nico was going faster and could've overtaken him in the post race interview
So let him past. Even if Brawn had said to maintain positions, Hamilton could easily have replied "You know what, it's my best friend, it's for a podium position, he's clearly quicker than I am, I'll let him past and we'll still finish 3rd and 4th, without any risk to the team. If I'm as good a driver as I think I am, it won't make a difference to the championship." But he didn't do that. I actually support team orders. But not this early in the season, particularly when it's far from proven that Hamilton will be the quicker of the two in the long run. Giving him #1 status this early in the season leaves a nasty taste in my mouth. Particularly as I've heard from others that it's contractually guaranteed.
Re: Motorsport Enthusiasts Corner
Posted: Tue Mar 26, 2013 1:01 pm
by Andy Hall
No you've heard from people who think it's contractually agreed
Simple fact, Lewis doesn't know that team, hasn't been there long enough to say i'm not doing that, and at the moment he's playing a very good political game, Lewis is as bad as Vettell and Schumacher when it comes to winning at any cost, but if he's to get the trust from his team he has to play the long game, and obeying orders is the quickest way to do that, Lewis Hamilton is the last person I would trust in an F1 car, but at the moment, he needs to play the game, Ross Brawn made the call, and he's followed orders, he isn't in charge of that team, Ross Brawn is